"Inspired to Invest" Podcast

The Significant Power & Possibilities Of Infinite Banking | Wealth Wednesdays 4 with Megan Betker

• Serena Holmes

Share episode

Welcome back to Wealth Wednesdays! In this episode, I sit down with Megan Betker, a financial planning expert, to dive deep into the world of wealth building, financial security, and the power of Infinite Banking. 🚀💰

We discuss:
âś… How to take control of your financial future
âś… What Infinite Banking is and how it works
âś… Smart strategies to grow and protect your wealth
âś… Common financial mistakes & how to avoid them

If you're ready to build lasting wealth, reduce financial stress, and create a strategy that works for you, this conversation is a must-watch!!

🔔 Don’t forget to like, subscribe, and hit the notification bell so you never miss a Wealth Wednesday episode. Let’s get you on the path to financial freedom!

đź“© Want to learn more? Connect with Megan Betker @meganbetker on social

📢 Join the Conversation! Drop your questions in the comments below. What are your biggest financial planning challenges?

#WealthWednesdays #FinancialPlanning #InfiniteBanking #MoneyMatters #WealthBuilding #FinancialFreedom

Support the show

Speaker 1:

Second, it's plugging in. Hey everybody, welcome to Wealth Wednesdays, a new webinar series hosted by Inspired to Invest to discuss all things related to abundance, prosperity and wealth. Today, I've got Megan Becker joining me, from Vantage Point Financial in Victoria BC. She is an entrepreneur, real estate investor and financial advisor specializing in helping real estate investors and business owners implement the power of infinite banking, and if you don't know what that is, then you're in for a treat. As a business owner and real estate investor herself, she realizes that the standard financial plans and strategies don't always work for entrepreneurs or investors. Her purpose is to share the specifically designed strategies that truly help clients take control of their finances, grow their net worth and enjoy the lifestyle and security that it provides them.

Speaker 1:

We're going to be going through some questions in the first half of the webinar and then opening up for guests, but if you do have a question that you'd like to ask, I would encourage anyone that joins a call to jump in and ask it, so they don't miss a moment. And before we get started, I'm going to read a very brief disclaimer. The views represented on this webinar are for general information only and do not constitute investment or other professional advice or an offering of securities. The hosting guests featured on this webinar do not make any representations as to the performance of any particular investment. Should you decide to make an investment, you're responsible for conducting your own review and analysis, and it's highly recommended that you obtain legal, accounting and tax advice from licensed professionals before you make any investments. So, with that being said, thank you for joining us, megan and all the guests. How are you?

Speaker 2:

today. Hi, serena, I'm doing well.

Speaker 1:

Thank you so much for having me so obviously I gave you a little bit of a high-level overview. Is there anything you wanted to add? Just to highlight your experience before we dive into some of the questions.

Speaker 2:

No, I think that's great. Obviously, what you kind of highlighted is what I do for my day job. I obviously um also am heavily invested in real estate, so that's a really big proponent of um, I guess, my what I believe in, in building wealth and things like that. So I know we're going to talk a lot more about that today, but, um, yeah, definitely.

Speaker 1:

We all have these side hustles right.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and I I just think it's so interesting, right, like I mean I really wish that I knew about infinite banking at least maybe six months to 12 months before I did, because I think you know some of the things that I've experienced in the last little while would be very different that I know and what I know now. But, just starting from the beginning, when we're talking about things like mindset and abundance, I think mindset is so important because it really sets your foundation for everything. So, just in your opinion, what do you think are some of the limiting beliefs about wealth that you experience with some of your clients and how are you helping people overcome it?

Speaker 2:

I think we have all so many like internal limiting beliefs, likely from like childhood or stories that we kind of learned over time. But some that I personally experienced and then I also witnessed is like I think a really big one is like I need to work harder to make money. So we're conditioned to believe that like wealth is directly tied to how much we are working. But the truth is it's really about how we're leveraging our time, our capital. Instead of trading hours for dollars, like trying to focus on creating systems and like a foundation where your money can really work for you. So real estate things like infinite banking and whole life insurance, cash flowing assets those things are all able like passive things that can be working for us in the background, instead of us just kind of punching that clock right, like a lot of us that are really focused on building wealth, maybe trying to get out of that nine to five rat race, and we need to be putting our money to use and get it working for us to be able to be able to shift where our time is kind of all going. So that's a huge one.

Speaker 2:

Another is like debt is bad. I've heard that probably since I was a child. To be honest, that's the mentality that my parents were kind of raised on and I think not all debt is created equal and like the key to understanding the difference between good debt, which is like the debt that makes you money, versus bad debt, which is like the consumables and where we're just our money is kind of going out, I think really kind of grasping that can make a huge difference in actually being able to build wealth for you in the short, medium and long term. So I think those are some really big limiting beliefs. What are some that you've experienced?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I would agree with that and I mean, I think, at the end of the day, people need to really consider how they could, you know, work smarter, not harder, right?

Speaker 1:

So, and I think it really just depends on who you talk to.

Speaker 1:

Like, I know, you know Scott's here joining us on the call, for example, and one of the things that I shared with him is I actually had an infinite banking policy, but it really was not described to me in that way.

Speaker 1:

I didn't understand everything I could use it for and I mean I had it going back probably gosh 10 or 12 years ago and I held on to it for a long time and then I was kind of like, do I really need this? I feel like I'm overinsured and like, yes, they explained you could overfund it with the cash value, but I was like I didn't really get it, get it right. It wasn't until a synergy call actually, when we had another company on that was talking about it, and really like how you can leverage it, and I was like, ah, and it just goes to show you like how important it is to get those second opinions and third opinions, because you may not really get it the first time right, like it was kind of sold to me, but I just didn't see that that value Right, something I see often like there's like a lot of parents will get these type of policies designed for their children and then they pass them on.

Speaker 2:

And then you see these people that are in their like early twenties and they're like I have this policy and it has money in it. Why, why do I need insurance? Like there's no, there's no education or time spent in teaching them about the actual tool that they have there, as opposed to just okay, well, here's a denomination of money that you can go and could go spend right and to that point, not even like what are the ways you can spend that money, as opposed to just with taking it out and canceling everything?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, so why don't we dive into that? Because I think a lot of people have no idea what infinite banking is.

Speaker 1:

If you are an entrepreneur, an investor, maybe a couple percent of them might know what this is, but can you break it down in terms of what it is and why it's valuable, and why it is such an important tool for someone like a real estate investor that maybe they've got some capital that they want to deploy, and what those steps would be, why you maybe put it in a policy first and then borrow it against it or for, like an entrepreneur like that might be amassing money in like a trust or a or something like that, just so that people really understand what what it is, how you can use it and some tangible examples?

Speaker 2:

Yeah. So honestly, there's so many points that we could go into with those different descriptions, but, like, I'll try to take it down to like pretty simplistic. So if you it's really about like your money being able to do more than one job, in my opinion, like, from that perspective, if you have a pool of money that's sitting there, you can think about like a saver, or a description that I like to give is the saver, the spender or the wealth creator? So the saver, you spender, or the wealth creator? So the saver, you accumulate that money. So you have that pool of money in your whole co or you have it built up to be able to go deploy to real estate. So you've saved that money up and you withdraw it from whatever vehicle it's in and you go and deploy it. Well, then you've kind of you saved up and then you're back to kind of square one because all that money has been deployed. So you do have that asset, but it's kind of gone all the way down. So we have the spender, who will, instead of saving to deploy, they accumulate debt and then they spend, and then they spend the next, however long, paying off that debt, whereas you have the wealth creator, which is the idea of kind of infinite banking and the use of these participating whole life insurance policies, where you can put your capital into that pool so you're saving it in this vehicle, so it's going to accumulate and save and instead of having to withdraw it and kind of start back at zero to go deploy it, you're able to leverage it, so you're able to borrow against that cash value, which essentially is like equity, and go and deploy it into, say, real estate value, which essentially is like equity, and go and deploy it into, say, real estate.

Speaker 2:

Or there's a lot of advantageous reasons of doing this type of structure in a holding company or in the corporate setting. So then you're not just depleting that savings. It's still going to continue earning, still going to continue earning its dividends, while you're able to use that money to go put in another investment. And because it's an investment that's going to continue earning its dividends, while you're able to use that money to go put in another investment and because it's an investment that's going to generate profit, that becomes a tax deduction for you. So there's, you're able to have your money earning in the policy and earning in real estate or whatever other investment.

Speaker 2:

It is that you choose, but you're able to get your money doing more than one thing at a time, right? So I think that that's a huge prop, huge proponent. A lot of us think and it's something that I thought when I was younger is oh well, my money can only do one job. I save it and I go use it. Um, and you don't. If you don't know the problem, like you don't, if you haven't been introduced to this, you haven't you. There's just no reason why most people would be like okay, well, this must be wrong.

Speaker 1:

like unless're using it while I'm saving it.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, right, like like that's what I grew up with is that you save it and you go use it for other people it's debt and then pay it back, right? So it's just a different way of thinking, and until you're introduced to a different way of thinking, it's I don't know. You don't know what you don't know, right? It's I don't know, you don't know what you don't know Right Now.

Speaker 1:

Can you explain just the whole term, be the bank, no-transcript, whatever it may be, because I think it's something that people really don't like. They can't really wrap their head around Like well, how is this possible? Right, and I think I have a great analogy. Actually, scott had shared with me that I go into where he can even talk about at some point in time. But you know, it was just, it was it really takes some time to just wrap your head around it, so I'm sure you can explain it far better than I can.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. So in terms of like becoming the bank. So when you're putting the money into the policy, if you put your money into a savings account, bank account, if you go and get a loan, you are making a little measly amount that you have in the savings account at the bank and then you're paying this high amount to go and borrow any type of capital, whether it's a loan, credit cards, line of credit, things like that. So they're making this spread on you, right, if you think about being able to put money into a policy and it's growing for you, so you're earning like a reasonable rate of return, especially given the conservative nature of these policies. And then you're able to leverage.

Speaker 2:

Yes, you were borrowing the insurance company's money from that policy. You're using your cash value essentially as collateral. It's the equity. It's very similar to like a home and a HELOC. So it's the equity that you have in your policy and it's so it's secured to that lender. So there you're able to borrow against it and then the interest that you're paying part of the participating whole life insurance. Why it's called participating is because the owners of the policies they share in the profits of essentially the capital that's in there that is being invested. So when you take a policy loan, that is a part of the investment pool, of the money that's in there growing and paying you your dividend. So are you paying the whatever the rate of interest rate is to yourself? No, you're paying it to the insurance company which is indirectly going into that investment pool and servicing your dividend that you're getting. So you're indirectly getting some of that back and supporting the growth of your overall investment.

Speaker 1:

So talk about, maybe, some of the limitations. There is someone that reached out to me on Instagram and you know anytime he'll speak about infinite banking. He's a naysayer, Very strong opinions about why it's actually not. You know the epitome of what everyone kind of says and stuff like that. So keep talking about, maybe, why this may not necessarily be good for everybody, and like there could be any circumstances where it doesn't work the way that somebody would anticipate that it would.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. So, like anything, there's always going to be people that are pro and con to it, whether or not they have done enough due diligence in my opinion, or they are just of a different mindset, and that's okay as well. So some reasons why it may not work. To be able to build up these policies it's predicated on a. There is a base cost, there is an insurance premium that goes into it, so that needs to be serviced, and then your service. Then you're adding an additional capital. So sometimes that's a situation that I may see someone. That's not suitable. Maybe they don't have enough capital to be actually directing into this policy to grow and accumulate to a point that they're going to be able to borrow from it or have it service anything.

Speaker 2:

If that's the case, then if they're just paying for the pure insurance, then we need to look at okay, is it the right time for this tool? Is it the right situation? That's my personal perspective on trying to establish whether or not it's a right fit for somebody. Why may it not work? So you're contractually able to take a policy loan at any time. That is written into the contract, whatever your cash value is. You're able to borrow up to 90% of that. It is very flexible repayment. You can technically not necessarily have to pay back.

Speaker 1:

I see a lot of like TikTok saying, oh, you never have to pay off that loan, okay, well no-transcript like no, no, it's not yeah, to be set up a certain way just to make sure they're compliant when it comes to things like CRA. And you know, even just the differences between Canada and the States I understand are quite different right.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, with, like Canada and the States, like the policies are structured very differently Some pros to the policies in the States and some pros to the policies in Canada. Like it's just just the way it is. For example, in the States, policy loans are never taxable, which is really advantageous here, once there's something called the adjusted cost basis, which is essentially all the capital you accumulated in that policy minus the pure cost of insurance. So, um, if once that acb goes, gets ground down, if you are borrowing more than what that acb is there, there could become a taxable event. And that's when we need to bring in either like a third party lender, to get a line of credit against the policy. And that's our way of it within the Income Tax Act of being able to kind of circumvent the policy, a policy loan being taxable. But yeah, so that's like one of the main differences.

Speaker 2:

So, can someone always take a policy loan? Yes, but it could come, there could be a circumstance where it's taxable, um, and then if you need to go get a third party lender, there is underwriting for that right, like it's underwriting, as if you were kind of going to go apply for a mortgage. So they're like in terms of like you're the naysayeraysayer, um, they could be looking at it as okay, well, you still have to incorporate a bank at that position and and you do, to be honest, right like, in order to make sure the functionality and the liquidity is still there in terms of your policy, um, you would need to incorporate a bank. So you're not completely getting rid of the bank, but we are trying to limit our reliance on it.

Speaker 1:

Um, so, yeah, okay, now, obviously not everyone comes into this as, like, a unestablished business owner or an investor that has a sizable portfolio. So for somebody that's just starting out, what would you say is some of the advice, like whether they're, you know, in university or just graduating or something like that, and they want to get on that path to starting to create wealth, like what, what kind of advice would you give to them?

Speaker 2:

okay, um, I think, get in the right rooms and surround yourself with people that are already where you want to be. I think that's like such a huge thing. Like success leaves clues. One of the fastest ways to build wealth just isn't through books and courses, but I think those are great.

Speaker 1:

Don't get me wrong but it's like, but verify. I said in trust, but verify a hundred percent, right, if I've learned anything in the last couple of years like that would probably be one of the biggest takeaways.

Speaker 2:

Yeah for sure, but you can read, like there's so many books out there and a lot, of, a lot of us read books or do courses and then it kind of just falls, falls on, kind of like deaf I'm going to call it deaf ears after that Like we don't implement, we're not studying these books, we're just we we read them. We're like, oh yeah, that's good. But like being around people that are doing, doing the things and the conversations you're going to have, seeing what strategies you're using, like I feel like that it just gets into your, into your being, a lot more.

Speaker 1:

And that's why, like we're we both met in Synergy Mastermind, um, and I think that's why, like being in those types of networking groups, um is so I never heard of infinite banking prior to that right or described it the way that it was right, even though I had a financial advisor, I thought I was doing you know the right things. But then you again, you look at something differently. It's going to start to look different.

Speaker 2:

Right, well, like, even like I think about myself, like again, like going back to when I was really young, like I, I was a great saver. I, I, I know, looking back, I had enough capital I could have gotten into real estate. Then I didn't know about it. I didn't know about whole life insurance and these, this tool that I could also build wealth and then go do real estate, and I had the assets to be able to do it. And I didn't. I wasn't around the people that were doing it, that were talking about it, so I had no idea what was possible, right? So my world was just a lot smaller. And until you start getting into these rooms where people are trying different things and talking to other people as well, like the the value of a mentor or or just getting different ideas than those, just like the small knit group that you're around on a weekly, daily basis, I think it's just like I don't know. There's nothing that can really compete with it.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, Now for some of the mistakes that people can make early on. What would you say is something that is pretty common, that you see often and maybe the good sidetrack them when they're starting to consider growing their wealth and taking those first steps.

Speaker 2:

So I think there's a couple of points that one that I've always kind of seen in what I do, and then another that I've seen really commonly in real estate in the last little bit. So the first is, like not knowing your numbers, um, if you aren't aware of where your income's coming in, what's going out, it's really hard to pay down debt, save, invest, come up with any of the like a plan if you don't know where you're starting off with. So that's, whether, like, you're looking at like a monthly budget and recalibrating quarterly or annually, looking at your net worth statement and seeing, like, am I making any progress? Like, if you don't know, you're not in tune with those things. I think it's very tricky and you're kind of just like flying by the seat of your pants hoping everything's going to go well in terms of building well right, like you really don't know at the end of the day if it's going in your favor.

Speaker 1:

Are there any tools that you recommend to people when it comes to things like budgeting and wealth saving, Like? Are there any apps that you generally like?

Speaker 2:

So I am. I'm not very tech friendly. There's there's a ton of apps out there. I use an Excel sheet. I I grew up on like HGTV Gail Van Oxlade, so she had little envelopes for money. So like I budget by using I'm a little bit more advanced, like I have actual accounts, not envelopes nowadays, um, but I have like accounts that certain different things go into and that capital is all allocated in those places so that I know where money is coming in and coming and going out, what discretionary capital I have and making sure that like I'm paying myself first. So like I know that money is getting put into where it's going to be investment or in savings and things like that. Before before I had the opportunity of going and spending on something because life is expensive, Like it's. If you just leave that all that money in in your basic account or you're not tracking these things in an app or some kind of a Excel sheet, then it's very easy to for it to just go poof and you're like, oh, where did that money go?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I can appreciate that completely Now, in terms of things like balancing your short-term gains with your long-term wealth building, like, obviously, people still need to live. They're still going to want to have discretionary income that they can use for the like traveling or shopping and things like that. So how do you suggest that people find the balance?

Speaker 2:

You know what this one is tricky, like the short-term gains and long-term wealth building. I find it tricky because I think a lot of people would kind of jump to the longer term planning, which I think is good, like there's not a right or a wrong way of doing this. Like I personally, like I've had rental properties, so that's like more on like the long term building strategy side of things, but it has some. If you could have a cash flowing property, which is what I really really can encourage people to look for and not necessarily kind of deviate from that, then you can have some short term gains which are going to add to potentially, either your ability to accumulate, to invest more or for spending you need to add in more consumables.

Speaker 2:

But I've kind of like I've predicated the last probably five, six years of like building houses on short term gains, like short term, like build a house, sell it to accumulate capital, and my move there has really been to for capital accumulation so that we can keep scaling the projects that we're doing with our own money instead of using other people's money other people's money and with the intention of holding soon, like we're going to build something like that's strategically designed for this for the long-term strategy.

Speaker 2:

And then I have pieces like infinite banking, like dividend paying, whole life insurance, which I can see as a long-term wealth building strategy. So like I'm putting my capital into there and I'm doing my short-term gains, like I'm funding it with money coming. That's in my long-term strategy. So I know in the long-term that'll help fund my, my retirement, which is going to be fantastic, but I still have that, the liquidity and the capital to use in the short term. So like we do need liquidity to be able to take advantage of of opportunities, right? So we need to kind of prioritize the ability to either save capital and be able to deploy it, as opposed to like I've just seen a lot of people that are like in real estate, that are asset rich, cash poor, and then something goes sideways, like as in everything, in the dirt.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, like the last three years, four years, and then we're stuck. Yeah.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah, and that's the thing. There's so many companies that we've obviously seen that have hit issues with insolvency and I don't think I've ever heard the word liquidity as often as I have in this last little while, right, but I think that that's really valuable and I, you know, maybe it takes a little bit longer when you're using your own money, but now, with some of the things that have happened, like I do think that I see so much more value in not selling yourself short and trying to figure those things out. And you know, I think you just have to have a balanced approach to where you're getting your active income and, like you said, some of that active income if it goes into a hold co and you can kind of keep that machine moving in that respect, right, and it's separate from, maybe, the money you make as a financial advisor and and things like that. Absolutely.

Speaker 2:

It's all about strategizing right, like looking at where all the money is, where all the assets are, and strategizing with like holistically yeah, we really do need to take that approach, yeah, um tax optimization friendly yeah.

Speaker 1:

I mean obviously we spend so much money between, like, the money we lose on income tax and what we're spending like it's not like we're trying to find loopholes to totally get out of it, but at the same time, like there are ways that you can be far more efficient than I think the average person would consider um, there's a brother institute study that came out.

Speaker 2:

It was 2024 but, like 43 percent of Canadians, income is going to taxation, like sales tax, like all the different taxes, right, and and it, it, it sucks, I don't know.

Speaker 2:

Like I, I feel like it sucks right, like we are everyone's feeling the strain of that weight, of having to lose so much of our what we're working for.

Speaker 2:

Um, and I know Scott who's who is on the call, and one of my favorite things that he's ever he had as a background one time was like taxes, theft, and I'm I am a proponent of that and I think it's a very controversial statement, uh, for some people, but I think it's a very controversial statement, uh, for some people, but I think it's very true. But we have the ability to structure our affairs in a tax-efficient manner and whether or not you choose to do that is really up to you. But you can either make the conscious decision of deploying what options and control you have, or you can just let, or you can just kind of take the victim mentality of oh, what was me? This is how it, this is just how it is, and that kind of goes with anything right, like you can either do do the things and see what solutions there are, or you can just look at the problem.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, no, absolutely. Now, when you look at things like generational wealth, I'm sure that you work with a lot of affluent clients and just from your experiences working with them and just your own plans when it comes to approaching building generational wealth, what kind of advice would you have, based on some people that you've encountered and you know, maybe, some of the things that they're doing that may not be totally mainstream?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, like what? What I do with like infinite banking and dividend paying, whole life insurance, like it's predicated on the idea of building generational wealth, so it's a huge proponent of what we're doing. And you see people like build up really large portfolios and like real estate and or or businesses or other portfolio, like other investments and being able to pass those on to the next generation. It does take planning and strategizing for how you can do that efficiently and the use of insurance is one of those most valuable ways of being able to do that in a really efficient manner. But, that being said, like if we are going to like what's the saying is that accumulated wealth will be in one generation is going to be lost by the third generation, right? So it's really about teaching the people that we're passing that wealth on to, about those tools, in my opinion.

Speaker 2:

So, like my son's only seven, he doesn't understand what I talk about insurance. He doesn't even know what that word means or these policies, but like it's still a part of the conversation, whether or not it's sinking in yet, because I want him to be able to see what these tools do and what the real estate that me and my spouse are are involved in and these policies, how we're using them to build for him and his children, and over time, my hope is that we can have more in-depth conversations about it, because if he doesn't understand the value or what it is that he's getting, then it's just really scary, right Like there's nothing saying that it won't just be dwindled.

Speaker 1:

And I think it's because oftentimes in a lot of families like money is not really openly discussed, right Like there are a lot of families that are. You know, I don't want to brushstroke everybody right.

Speaker 1:

But I think that the new generations are seeing a lot more value in that and they're probably far more open about it than maybe our parents or our grandparents generation. Like you didn't talk about what was brought home and you know my mom's family is probably on like the lower end of middle class and you know if they were lucky, they got one Christmas present, they had baths once a week. Like you know, they had one doll to share among four sisters, kind of thing, right. So it's a very different dynamic. But I think, just starting those conversations early, like with our daughter, we started giving her an allowance, so she gets a dollar a day, she's got to make her bed and she has to help with certain things.

Speaker 1:

And we're like you got your bucks for the week, so go to the store. Like you can buy something small or you can save them and you can save up for something a little bigger that you really want. You don't have to spend it. And just trying to be like you can choose one thing, not like four things. So we're really trying to make sure that she understands. Well, you know just where those values are and stuff like that. Right, and she's only five.

Speaker 2:

But we're starting to open up those doors it's just starting the conversation so that they're not like oblivious to it, right, like that was the thing that we didn't talk about money when I was a kid. Um, and I think that that, unfortunately, is really common and we try to have again maturity level dependent or dictated conversations. Like my son, he puts a certain amount, he has to put a certain amount of his allowance into savings, some to donating and then the rest, hey, if you choose to spend it this week or you can save it and accumulate, just like you said to, to a bigger amount to actually get something, I don't know, I can't even say it's actually a good thing.

Speaker 2:

but like a good toy or something, but of more value to him. And I think it's just again, again it's starting those conversations people have a lot like when our kids grow up.

Speaker 1:

They're they're growing up even very different than we did, because I don't think that they we had the access to the information that they will um but it's also figuring out how to streamline it right, like because, if anything, now there's almost so much in a day paralyze people the same way because they're like oh, oh, like there's too many options, like I don't really know what to do. And I think that's where a role like you comes in, where you can help people understand the lay of the land, figure out how you can help them put the puzzle pieces together to help them get where they're going to go Right.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and I think that people, like you said, people do get really overwhelmed and they can kind of take it back to like, okay, what are your goals and why are those your goals, and then start looking out for tools that can help you achieve them, as opposed to like, okay, well, maybe I just do X, y and Z and they'll, it'll get me somewhere. Yeah, right, yeah, because again, like, even like I'll go on social media and I'll get, and I'll get overwhelmed with the different things that are coming up on there. That sounds great, yeah 100% Like.

Speaker 2:

everything sounds great on social media right, Like they're not putting out the things that don't sound great.

Speaker 1:

Well, that's just it. And then just the education component. Like I'm one of the business ambassadors for the Wealth Club and we have a couple of guys that coach on crypto. So like you've heard about it but I didn't really understand it, but then they really educated around. You know some of the cycles and the currency and the. You know all these different things and literally it showed all the charts and what the signals are and stuff like that and I found it just really fascinating because it's just something that it's like sounds like such a buzzword and people really have a hard time just even understanding what. It is much like infinite banking, but it's just to hear from someone that's really educating you based on all the history that kind of comes along with. It is just, I find it so interesting.

Speaker 2:

And find what you're interested in and then do more research, right?

Speaker 1:

Because if something that you're interested in, you're just going to be more inclined to it and also diversify like, obviously don't put all your eggs in one basket, and I think you have to figure out um, you know trusted sources and stuff like that. Like I was talking to someone that sounds like they're a victim of a crypto scam, right, so it was something that they took that chance and, yeah, it just is so unfortunate they're trying to figure all that stuff out now, but um, doesn't mean they're all scams, but you really have to make sure that you're like any industry, there's always going to be the people that are, that have the experience and doing what it is that they're talking about, and then, like in any industry crypto, um, life insurance and infinite banking like there's going to be people that are coming from like mortgage brokers, like I'm just shocked at the amount of fraud we're seeing in the mortgage industry.

Speaker 1:

Right, like how is it possible that a broker would take like 300 million dollars and just disappear with almost no trace of the money? And you're like I know, like a magician.

Speaker 2:

It wasn't a mortgage broker. How is it?

Speaker 1:

possible. Like you think, with things being digital, it should be so much easier to trace things like that right. So it's definitely been a really fascinating year. Just to see everything that's happened and hopefully you know we're all going to come back with it in different ways. See everything that's happened and hopefully you know we're all going to come back with it in different ways. But looking back at your history now, like you're not that old yet, obviously, but just when you look back at your younger self like what would you say is one thing you look back and you're like if you could give yourself advice if you went back 15 or 20 years, what advice would you give yourself when it comes to money mindset and investing?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, so I kind of already touched on it Like it really is. Like for me it's about the money and the investing pieces that, like again, I was a really great saver. Like that was like really pounded into me to save your money, not have debt. Like I think I was like it was my day after my 18th birthday. It wouldn't open an RSP because, like, that's what you did right, as opposed to so many regrets about RSPs. No way. But yeah, like that's the thing. Like so I was really good saver, but I didn't know anything about leverage. I didn't know about the tools that I could have deployed that money into.

Speaker 2:

That would have not that I'm in a bad place, but it would have really like I would be in a much different place today. Yeah, if I had gotten into real estate when I was was 1920, when I had all that capital already saved up and I could have real estate was a lot more affordable, then, yeah, right, like I could have. Like it would have been like a heyday compared to now. So, like that's the thing. Like I really wish that if I had, like it would have been to the things that I thought were so far out of reach, which is like I remember my dad coming to me and being like hey, do you want to get into real estate and development? Like he had a lot of faith in me. He's like we could start looking at this and see if this is something.

Speaker 2:

And I'm like real estate development, like that's something that, like 50 year old, really rich people did yeah, and 50 was was. I'm coming from a 19 year old perspective. That was old, but now I'm like that's nothing. Um, but yeah, like you know what I mean. Like that's I didn't know what I didn't know, so it would definitely be getting into rooms. Like I see people, really young now, getting into these masterminding and networking things. They're like 22 23.

Speaker 2:

It's like I'm just gonna go buy an apartment building it's like what right, like it could have been doable and that's. And that's the thing. Like so, um, I don't know 10 of these right now, I know and I'd be laughing and that's the thing. So, like it really is about, um, you know, and looking into those pardon, I said who you know and what they can teach you 100.

Speaker 2:

So getting around people that are doing more like I was just so at that age I felt so like inferior and intimidated by people that I thought were successful. I never would have. Like I didn't ask the questions and I really wish that I had had conversations with other people that would have suggested that that was accessible and that I could have done that. So, yeah, looking at, for those I don't. It's tricky Cause, like how, how do you teach someone that? But really learning how money works and understanding the power of capital and leverage and the way the systems that you can set up and to get your money working for you I really wish that someone had talked to me about that. So I would love for younger people to have the piece of advice to just start exploring some of those options.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah, no, absolutely, I think that's where all of it starts. Now we'll open up the floor. We've been going for about 40 minutes, a little bit longer than anticipated, but for anyone that is on the call, now is your kind of chance to jump in if you have any questions for megan or myself and just kind of open up the dialogue. Scott or francesca, if you have any thoughts or questions, maybe, maybe not. No, I'm uh, I'm totally good. Thank you, though.

Speaker 1:

Yeah there's one metaphor that scott actually gave me early on when we met. He talked about you know, just the cycle that most people follow and it's just like you know when they make money and spend it. Make money and spend it, and it's that's really the essence of the issue, right? So he compared it to you know, harvesting a field. He's like, if you have, I was gonna say like that's of the like when I met Scott.

Speaker 2:

That's one of the examples that he gave me it makes perfect sense, cause you're like.

Speaker 1:

You know, you don't go cut the apple tree down, you just pick the apples.

Speaker 2:

And so for anyone that watches this, like what that analogy was is that would you rather pay, like pay tax on the harvest or on like at the beginning, right so, and that kind of on the harvest or on like at the beginning, right so. And that kind of kind of goes to like RSPs, like when we get caught in this cycle, like oh, we want the tax deduction, so we don't want to pay the tax right now, so instead we'll defer it till when it's way bigger, so we can plant this apple tree and we can pay tax right now, before we've got all those apples, and it'll be a little amount. Or we can let this this apple tree grow and we can have this huge harvest and then have to pay tax on that larger amount.

Speaker 1:

Um, part of the issue, I think, with RSPs. So, just going back to that point, like when I had a financial advisor like again, he wasn't, I think, self-serving, his own interests and not looking out for me but I had been able to back my pay myself through my business. We landed a, a big contract we hadn't paid ourselves. In like over a year I had a lump sum of money and it was maybe like 30 grand or something. Yeah, my priority was I wanted to buy a house. He suggested putting it into an RSP. You can use your first time home buyer privilege.

Speaker 1:

And what I didn't understand was just how I'm required to pay that back. And knowing it was in this such immediate future, like within a year or two, that made no sense. And, if anything, I ended up losing money when I took it out because of like an early withdrawal three and that's not the next thing. So like it made no sense that I should have done that. And then, on the flip side, I had a family member that had very high incomes. So, going back to the early 2000s, like about 350,000 a year, which, when you think back to that period, yeah, substantial amount for sure. About 350,000 a year, which, when you think back to that period, yeah, substantial amount for sure. Like that's like a million dollars a year now Very high RSPs.

Speaker 1:

And the issue is that you assume I'm going to withdraw whatever amount that is every year for 20 years in my retirement. Well, what if you don't see retirement? Like what if you have get sick and you have to take that all at once? Like there is such a significant tax impact and even if you do pass it down to your beneficiary, there's also an additional tax impact on them, based on their current earnings, in addition to that inheritance. So to me it just felt very cumbersome and there was a lot of things that, like you know, if maybe you live at your retirement as you plan it, it could be great, but you also think there's a good chance that you may not.

Speaker 2:

That's presuming that tax rates rates are gonna not go up over time. Yeah, so there's just a lot of caveats to that in my mind.

Speaker 1:

So for me I haven't really been a proponent of RSPs, like I do like the concept of the TFSA, I like infinite banking and like you know there are different things. But again, it just comes down to knowing, like, what you want and you know what the consequences are if maybe things you know do detour from your original plan.

Speaker 2:

Right 100, like I took out. I contributed to my rsp since I was 18, uh, because I thought I had like such a low taxable income. I don't even know that I paid tax at that point.

Speaker 1:

So why I?

Speaker 2:

needed a deduction beyond me, um, it probably got like two percent. But like um I now in paying back that, that homebuyer's plan, I pay way more tax on it now because I'm in a higher tax bracket and I like I'm like even last week I met with um like a high income earning business professional. He has his business. We're looking at structuring his overall um how what he can be doing within his retained earnings. But he's taking a significant amount of income and he has a large amount of RSPs and he's like I don't even know what to do. Like he's like I contributed to these when I was in, like, say, the 30% tax bracket. He's like now I'm in the 50. And it's not going to go down, so now I'm just withdrawing at 50. Now I'm just withdrawing at 50.

Speaker 2:

Now I'm paying way more than I ever got to begin with. So it's tricky because we don't necessarily know what we're going to make in the future, but we do hope it's going to be more. And I also don't know that. I have a ton of clients that want to have, are going to have less money in retirement or need less money to live off of. We might have structured it in a more efficiently so they have less taxable income but so that we could maybe draw down their rsps.

Speaker 1:

But still like, yeah, we need money I think about things from the standpoint of like how much flexibility you want, how much control over your earnings you want, and whatever is going to be most tax efficient, right, and again, think about that holistically, from the whole picture, not maybe like right now, but like in the long run. What's that going to look like in these three different scenarios? Right, but I think that really just comes down to the planning again.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and being in RSP season, I know this is a hot topic. I shouldn't keep going on it, but like we just get, get we see these messages that you have this deadline and I think it's the deadline that like it makes people worry about missing out, so they just automatically go contribute.

Speaker 2:

They don't know what it's like. Yeah, 100%. They're not looking at like is this the best tool? Does this make the most sense for overall? It's just like oh my gosh, I have a deadline which is next week, that I need to get this in now. You know what I mean, and there's financial trouble. Yeah, A hundred percent, Because there's like we all go into banks, we need like right. So that's where we're seeing all this.

Speaker 1:

On the radio. Whoever listens to the radio still like you'd see things like rsp, like deadlines coming up, like there's a lot of banks that advertise that, and I'd be curious to even see, like, what kind of an uptick that they get, because I'm sure, oh, it's huge, they're putting the money into advertising.

Speaker 2:

I'm sure it's they're seeing huge I know a lot of traditional financial uh planners that have wealth-based books of business, um, like rsps, and like january and and February is like they don't do anything else other than like select RSPs.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah, it's really fascinating. Is there anything else that you would want to touch on before we wrap up, for anyone that could be watching or listening, you know what, like I think we touched on a lot of different things.

Speaker 2:

I think the the last piece of kind of that I just would like to send home is really looking into the options, get in those groups, look at networking. I know you're a huge proponent of getting into different networking groups and you do really well at spreading the word of different tools that are in strategies that are out there there and the more that people can really lean into that and take some. Take, take a little nugget out and then explore it a little bit further and see if it's something that might be interested, that you might be interested in. I just think there's a huge amount of value that people can take away from these things without having to spend a lot of money.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah, absolutely, and I guess, before we wrap up, just extending it again, if Scott or Francesca want to jump in with anything, no, and if not, well, thanks for everyone that is tuning in, and Megan, of course. Thank you for your time, and if you're a busy day, I'm sure that this is a you know. Since it is nearing the end of tax season, I guess we'll see where things land.

Speaker 2:

Well, rsps aren't my thing, so we're good on that, on that. But I still really appreciate you having me on and always enjoy having conversations with you, serena.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, absolutely well. Thanks again for your time and, of course, for everyone that is tuning in. Keep in mind when you invest in yourself the sky's the limit. Thanks again, thank you.